The maniplutating of the WTF RR play on all platforms

[BrushedBigJJ]

I've been playing at itst for about 6 months so this is my first time being in and watching how the World Tour Finals operates. From years past it looks like there were no deadlines for Round Robin group play. If I'm wrong on that someone please let me know.

Before the deadlines were put in people could easily manipulate the order of the matches that they played to benefit them depending on if they wanted to play someone they considered easier first, or they may want to play the person they consider hardest first, whatever benefits them.

My first 2 questions have been answered with this from the Playstation 3 ts4 tour forum:

We do not mind if you do not play the matches in the order that is presented. Just make sure that the match you have to play within a certain deadline is played by then. If you have scheduling issues contact the host like you would do for a normal tournament.

1. Can someone substitute the first match deadline for another match down the line and fulfill the first deadline?


My first concern is again manipulating the match order. My second concern is the other 2 in the group now have not completed a match in the first deadline, but were trying to complete it with the people they were suppose to. Now there's a back log and the people who were trying to schedule it properly have 3 matches to play in much less time.

From the answer above it sounds like the answer is no, you cannot substitute matches and count that match as your first completed deadline.


2. Is the final deadline for the third match the only date that really matters?

Again manipulating match order, and back logging the tournament.

From the answer above it sounds like the group section deadlines do matter.

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These questions have not been answered.

The WTF page says this:

- The final standings of each group shall be determined by the first of the following methods that apply:
a) Greatest number of wins.
b) Greatest number of matches played.
c) Head-to-head results if two players are tied.

1. If someone is not the cause of a walkover, does the match count as a "match played" for them?

I assume it counts as a win, but if it doesn't count as a "match played" someone could lose a tiebreaker because their opponent couldn't/wouldn't play the match.

2. I don't see any rules for the 2-1 three way tie for first in a group, and I don't see any rules for a 1-2 three way tie for second in a group. How do the itst tiebreak rules work for these situations?

In the real life WTF the tiebreak rules in those situations goes to number of sets won, then number of games won, then they may even go to number of points won. I want to make a suggestion on this. Instead of number of sets won, it should be least number of sets lost. The reason I say that is because if someone(person a) wanted to manipulate something by allowing a match to go 3 sets so the other person(person b) gets an extra set won to help them(person b) in a tiebreak situation it doesn't hurt them(person a) to throw away a set because things are only based on sets won. They(person a) still got their two sets to win the match. However when it is based on least number of sets lost, they now hurt themselves(person a) by giving away that set when it comes to tiebreak rules at the end of round robin play. And person b doesn't get a tiebreak boost by being given a free set.

[SlicerITST]

As ive been around since the WTF in 2005 i can say we usually have deadlines for the first round group matches. I know we didnt have them last year and the tournaments dragged on. Same with the WS WTF this year that take a lot longer. Deadlines are important to get tournaments finished at all.

A match deadline is for the first 2 matches. You cannot substitute them for another match you played. Otherwise you would be correct in saying only the last deadline would matter.

[SlicerITST]

In the 7 years before i had to split a three way tie once. So you could say its pretty rare. I used the most sets and then games won rule. Your idea sounds good but it would not be a solution. You are closing one door for manipulation but opening another.

That is because the walkovers do count as matches played but of course it would not affect sets played. So with your idea in place it might be better to give a walkover to the best player then to play him. And i believe this situation would occur more often then the situation you describe.

[BrushedBigJJ]

In the 7 years before i had to split a three way tie once. So you could say its pretty rare. I used the most sets and then games won rule. Your idea sounds good but it would not be a solution. You are closing one door for manipulation but opening another.

That is because the walkovers do count as matches played but of course it would not affect sets played. So with your idea in place it might be better to give a walkover to the best player then to play him. And i believe this situation would occur more often then the situation you describe.

I didn't think of manipulating things by avoiding the best player and giving him/her a walkover.

Will the manipulation ever end???

From what you said it sounds like the person who causes the walkover also gets a "match played" by his/her name. If that's the case then what stops someone from giving a walkover to the best player now. They stay even with everyone else with matches played at 3. If they win their other two matches, again they are in the tiebreak race. And if they beat the other person head to head they get to be second in the group and go to the semifinal. Something doesn't seem right there.

I think just like in itst tournaments where you get 0 points when you get walkedover, you should not be given credit for for a match played if you are walkedover. And since "matches played" are so high on the tie-break list, it makes it virtually impossible to get to 1 or 2 in the group if you are walkedover. And I would take it a step further that if you are walkedover, in a addition to not getting credit for a match played you should also get 2 lost sets against you. But I don't think that is even needed if they don't get a credit for a "matched played" because that tiebreak rule is higher.

OMG!!! I just thought of something. What if someone retires right at 5-0 to block someone from getting a set won, and making sure they don't get a set lost? Noooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[djarvik]