in sports, is it ok to do whatever it takes to win?

[coke4]

In pro sport, much like in modern life, you should do whatever it takes to win. Its up to the Ref to decide whats fair, not the players

[djarvik]

Let's pretend for a minute that everyone agrees that it was unintentional. If that were the case, did he cheat by not admitting to it? How often do players make calls against themselves? If the situation were reversed, do you honestly think a player on the Irish team would have made the call against himself? And if he did, would we then have a thread saying how that player blew the game by making such a stupid call?

Seems to me, that if it was unintentional, then every pro tennis player is a lying, dirty cheat, since they never make calls against themselves.

If we can really expect players to honestly make their own calls, then why even have officials?

but that is just it, intentional or not, the rule was broken and the direct result was a goal. ...it is not a lucky net cord ball like in tennis, it is a clear rule violation result in something Big. ....it would be like umpire in tennis announcing Rodick as a winner in Wimbledon, mistakenly....and then hold on to his decision

A video review similar to the one use in Footbal in US has to be implemented effective immediately. And this case we have here might be something that can give it the right push to actually happen.

Is the ref at fault - YES! ....is the ref the only one at fault - NO! The rule was broken and was caught on tape by the player.

[djarvik]

In pro sport, much like in modern life, you should do whatever it takes to win. Its up to the Ref to decide whats fair, not the players

Very true. It is also players responsibility to obey the rules. Intentionally

[Rob ITST]

I know it's not like a lucky net chord - it's like not calling your own shot out when you see it out, or letting the line judge call your opponent's shot out when you know it's good. If we could expect players to make those calls, then we wouldn't need umpires, and we certainly wouldn't need Hawkeye.

So imagine it's the Wimbledon final and break point against Federer. Federer hits a shot on the line, and Nadal knows it's good, but the line judge calls it out. Federer is out of Challenges, and now Nadal will be serving for the match. Do you think Nadal is giving that point back? I doubt it, and I doubt most players would. Granted some might, but most wouldn't.

Sorry, but cheating is cheating. If you expect pro athletes to make calls against themselves, then you have to hold them all to the same standard, no matter what the situation is. Or, you leave it up the officials. You can't say, "You should call this on yourself, but it's ok to not call something else", or "you call it on yourself if it's an important moment, but you can pretend nothing happened if you think it doesn't affect the outcome".

If it was intentional, then that's one thing (but no body besides Henry knows that). If it was not intentional, then I doubt he did anything worse than the vast majority of other players would have done.

[djarvik]

I know it's not like a lucky net chord - it's like not calling your own shot out when you see it out, or letting the line judge call your opponent's shot out when you know it's good. If we could expect players to make those calls, then we wouldn't need umpires, and we certainly wouldn't need Hawkeye.

So imagine it's the Wimbledon final and break point against Federer. Federer hits a shot on the line, and Nadal knows it's good, but the line judge calls it out. Federer is out of Challenges, and now Nadal will be serving for the match. Do you think Nadal is giving that point back? I doubt it, and I doubt most players would. Granted some might, but most wouldn't.

Sorry, but cheating is cheating. If you expect pro athletes to make calls against themselves, then you have to hold them all to the same standard, no matter what the situation is. Or, you leave it up the officials. You can't say, "You should call this on yourself, but it's ok to not call something else", or "you call it on yourself if it's an important moment, but you can pretend nothing happened if you think it doesn't affect the outcome".

If it was intentional, then that's one thing (but no body besides Henry knows that). If it was not intentional, then I doubt he did anything worse than the vast majority of other players would have done.

In football, points are rear and therefore have a lot of weight. In tennis you can challenge the calls - not in football. I am calling for video review of such moments.

BTW - by no means am I implying that the player should have called his own faul, I never said that. I am kinda trying to show that the fault doesn't lay 100% with official. System is at fault as well. Player is at fault here as well. His action were a major factor in outcome of the game, correct? ...did he break the rule?

....that is why I brought up a stupid analogy of Umpire faulsy proclaiming someone else a winner. As stupid as it is, it much closer then your analogy of a single point giving advantage to the server.

This is a severe miss that cost someone Grand Slam and was caught on tape. That is how I see it.

Video review would correct the mistake immediately and punish the other player/team by giving the possession to opposition. Simple.

[Q. Reese]

No. Cheating is not good at all, no matter how big or small the situation is.

[GOA MASTER MDMA]

i mean that to . he was focused to shot a goal in a regular way and in affect he use the hand !

not enough time to think about . it was a reflex !!

Maybe that was the case GOA, I respect your opinion and also Jaylove's, saying that it looks unintentional.

I strongly disagree that he didn't have enough time to think about it. All he needed was a split second, shall I put my hand there to bring the ball down, or shall I not... In that split second he made his choice. IMHO he knew exactly what he was doing. He may be regretting that choice now in hindsight. (This is not a recent event, but happened a few years back)

My view on this, is because I have intentionally handball in the past, and it didn't take me anytime to think about it! Now, a World class player like Henry, reason for doing is reflex and he didn't have time to think? I doubt it.

you ever played in 1 or second league ?
or better example , you ever saw LIVE a 1 league or a nationalteam match ?? mean not in TV - live in stadion ??
when you answer is yes ,than you know about the unbelieveble speed the ball runs between the player .
the speed is incredible
esspecially as forward it goes all very fast - you have a very small time to bring the ball under controll and to make something sensefull with the ball .also you know that you never plan in soccer to use your hand coz you got busted to 95 % and you earn to 100%a yellow card by handgame .
also a handgame bring you normally not an advandage
HENRY was focussed to reach the ball and in last moment as he saw that he cant reach the ball he used the hand . that is a tousand millisecond .
NEVER EVER YOU CAN PLAN THIS IN SO SHORT TIME -


i only have a different opinion in that case . i mean it was a reflex -a illegal reflex .
you really think henry plan this assist with his hand .
it is okay for me my friend .i will say that i absoltly respekt your opinion.

[Bowler2151]

the french player who is being called unsportsmanlike, If Ireland had the roles reversed Ireland would have done the samething the french player did. There playing to get in the biggest touranment in the world and if your hand hits the ball your not going to say anything. American football your taught, no matter what keep playing until you hear the whistle. plus those "mysterious" leg injuries soccer players get when there team has a lead isnt that unsportsmanlike, there running down the clock intentally by doing that.

[SoundfSilence]

you ever played in 1 or second league ?

No But I don't see that as relevant as 99.9% of people commenting here would not have either.

or better example , you ever saw LIVE a 1 league or a nationalteam match ?? mean not in TV - live in stadion ??

Yes, I have watched England International matches and Premier league games, live in the Stadium.

when you answer is yes ,than you know about the unbelieveble speed the ball runs between the player .
the speed is incredible

Yes, I agree.

HENRY was focussed to reach the ball and in last moment as he saw that he cant reach the ball he used the hand . that is a tousand millisecond .
NEVER EVER YOU CAN PLAN THIS IN SO SHORT TIME -

I wouldn't say he 'PLAN', that is not the right word.. I would say he consciously used his hand to get his result in controlling the ball in (and yes, in that thousandth millisecond).

I'll try and give an example to show my view that these professional players can make a decision in a short time (millisecond etc). Lets say a player is standing in a Wall defending a free kick. A booming 100mph free kick comes in, the player in the wall knows it is not going to hit him and if he doesn't stop it, there is a high chance it'll be a goal.. Now, the player sticks his hand out intentionally deflecting the ball off course. He had that thousandth millisecond to consciousloy make decision, should I use my hand or not...

So, my point is, yes, Henry being a World Class pro player had enough time (thousandth millisecond or whatever), for him to consciously handball or not. Did he have time to think what consequences would be after his actions? No. Did he 'plan' to do it? No. Did he cheat? Yes. If it was an Irish player or any other team, would they do it? Irrelevant.

Was the ref at fault? Yes.

So if the ref's at fault, why am I giving Henry a real hard time? Because who gives who the ref is? Henry is a role model. He has been a great ambassador for the game (IMHO). His actions totally send out the wrong message, and in a way ruins his years of good reputation.

It is ok for me too GOA, I respect and understand your opinion although I don't agree with some, I do with most