Lob Robs!

[djarvik]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBY9Ky8at4E

Sorry for the quality.

Remember, these videos are highlights only. The points are short because the players "chose" to make them short. Something that CAN be done in TS3 and cannot be done in TE (not even talking about TS4). As much as TE is great, it still fails to provide you with freedom of choice in that regard.

Players are "realistically heavy"...not just heavy. And yes, this is coming from a real life player.

TS4 is not even in contention here, horrible locked movement and shots...just bad. TE on the other had makes a great effort. But still fails to deliver. For example, in TS3, you needed timing skill to release the button on time, release too late - and you will be pushed by the ball, falling slightly backwards.....release too early and you will reach forward for the ball, causing it to pop up for an easy put-away. This part is completely missed by TE. In fact, you can hit good shots in TE from any position, even when starting to walk one way and the ball is hit right behind you....you quickly SNAP! turn around and hit a great shot. What about shifting the weight and fully rotating the body? ....and what about these inside out shots when your feet run one way and your upper buddy breaks in half to hit that shot in a matter of a split second?

Both games have their pluses, both great. If I had to pick one it would be tough decision, but for comfort, freedom, risk and endless depth - I would pick TS3.

[BrushedBigJJ]

Top Spin 4 looks like tennis of the 80's, Top Spin 3, it seems it's the tennis from the fifties : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnN2yABI3oc

When you show beginners of course it looks like the fifties. And yes the movement and risk shots are hard, if you make either easy its much less sim. The video djarvik showed shows how the game is played at an advanced level, not a beginner one. The guy he was playing (PCfitness) always played me close when I played him. Like in that video he would only risk shot/risk return if he had to. Sometimes he would wait too late and have no risk shot rhythm. But on the other hand if you didn't make your risk shots and/or place your serve you were in big trouble against him.

You were trying to make it look like I was afraid to play a sim tennis game against you. I've proven that's not true. Now the balls in your court. Are you the one that is afraid?

[BrushedBigJJ]

The points are short because the players "chose" to make them short. Something that CAN be done in TS3 and cannot be done in TE (not even talking about TS4). As much as TE is great, it still fails to provide you with freedom of choice

I'm sure this has been tested, but how come you can't bump up the power and decrease the precision and consistentcy so there is more risk more reward?

[C4iLL]

I'm not afraid, I've just no time to loose..

ps : lobs don't seem efficient in ts3, you would'nt have any chances then

[BrushedBigJJ]

Well it's clear to me you are afraid. And now everyone can see you didn't really want a real match, you just wanted to try to make me look bad, which once again you failed miserably at.

Oh, and your staple play of "hit a really weak shot then rush to the net" that worked really well in topspin 4, doesn't work in topspin 3, so you better try something new, if you ever get the courage to play.

[C4iLL]

Tennis Elbow's gameplay is more interesting than TS3 in my opinion ; the community is alive, tournaments are ongoing, why would I buy a dead game, just to play the worst lamer I ever met on TS4 ? It's a nonsense, YOU have to buy the game everyone plays. If you don't have the computer to make run a game created in early 2000, it's not my fault

If you want to play, it will be TE or nothing

[beltic caldy]

I'm in a horrible position, in a way.

TS3 was the first console tennis game I played - it took soooooooo long to get even half-decent, it was incredible and yet the experience of online play with it, especially within the ITST environment was the most amazing, fulfilling, frustrating, engaging, maddening rollercoaster I've ever experienced in any kind of online gaming - nothing even approaches - before, or since.

Then TS4 came along, and was quickly dismissed as crazy one-dimensional basher - I know it has it's fans, but it is shallow and glitzy when compared with TS3, for me.

As regards TE, I've not given it a chance at all, I'm afraid, so can't compare with the others.

So - the horrible position is that I would appear to have played the very best ever tennis SIM (it's really not a game, in the common sense) as my first.....in effect started at the top (spin?).....and the only way from here is dowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnn.

sigh.

[BrushedBigJJ]

So - the horrible position is that I would appear to have played the very best ever tennis SIM (it's really not a game, in the common sense) as my first.....in effect started at the top (spin?).....and the only way from here is dowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnn.
sigh.

Well, I have to slightly disagree. Imagine if they had just left in the l trigger and r trigger risk shot buttons in topspin 4. I think topspin 4 would have topped topspin 3. You could even leave in the dumb short cross court angle control shots, even those could be countered. We can only hope they do this for the rumored topspin 5.

[djarvik]

TS4 movement is horrid, the autos is bad, the "control" shots which BTW are there in TS3 as well, are horrid, the serving is horrid....etc....just too many things wrong with this game. Adding risk would make it better, maybe even good, but no even close to TS3 still.

I hope that the next game will be based on TS3 engine.

[BrushedBigJJ]

TS4 movement is horrid, the autos is bad, the "control" shots which BTW are there in TS3 as well, are horrid, the serving is horrid....etc....just too many things wrong with this game. Adding risk would make it better, maybe even good, but no even close to TS3 still.

I hope that the next game will be based on TS3 engine.

Explain what you mean by the serve being horrid. You can hit the serve wherever you want on first and second like topspin 3.

The "control" shots in these two games don't compare, you almost can't make an error in ts4, and you can hit flat extreme angle shots with decent pace.

The movement I agree with. But timing the incoming ball is where the depth is at, because each person you play will hit unique balls that you have to adjust to, and you have the ability (with the lt and rt buttons) to give them the type of ball they don't like or they struggle with.

[djarvik]

TS4 movement is horrid, the autos is bad, the "control" shots which BTW are there in TS3 as well, are horrid, the serving is horrid....etc....just too many things wrong with this game. Adding risk would make it better, maybe even good, but no even close to TS3 still.

I hope that the next game will be based on TS3 engine.

Explain what you mean by the serve being horrid. You can hit the serve wherever you want on first and second like topspin 3.

The "control" shots in these two games don't compare, you almost can't make an error in ts4, and you can hit flat extreme angle shots with decent pace.

The movement I agree with. But timing the incoming ball is where the depth is at, because each person you play will hit unique balls that you have to adjust to, and you have the ability (with the lt and rt buttons) to give them the type of ball they don't like or they struggle with.

The various spots I could hit and the types of serves possible. The complexity of serving GOOD. It was a real skill from a human. Even having 90 serve did not assure you of good serving.

Indeed, the control shots don't compare, TS4 is just plain dumb idea, TS3 it was a risky soft shot, mostly worked as a surprise or a pace changer against a risker. TS3 so called (still wrestling with the whole idea) control shots are way better executed.


"The movement I agree with. But timing the incoming ball...."

Why "But" ...."and" is more appropriate. (unless you meant TS4)

[BrushedBigJJ]

Ok...ok, bad grammar and paragraph/sentence structure. What I was trying to say was if topspin 4 had lt rt risk buttons, there would still be very little depth in character movement(which wouldn't matter much), but more than enough depth timing incoming balls and producing your own shots trying to balance unforced errors and winners.

[djarvik]

I was not poking at your grammar man, I suck at it (English is my 3rd best language), I was more agreeing with you in regards to TS3.

Sure there will be depth etc...TS4 is not a horrible game, it just pales in compassing SIM-wise when put against the TS3. Arcade-wise - it is a better game, more approachable etc. To each his own, so I speak only from personal experience from both games.