Summary of my R32 Pro Tour Roland Garros match

[Ary1g]

cross, short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross,short cross...

[djarvik]

So did you win?

[Ary1g]

Federer vs Agassi.. Who do you think won in the everlasting short cross battle?

[Tamthewasp]

Don't hit so many then

[djarvik]

Federer I guess. His cross court FH is nasty. And he has an Inside
Out Master, one can just camp anticipating cross court and hit FH all day.

[Ary1g]

This match just made me realize that this game don't have any future whatsoever with Flat control shots being allowed. Easy as that. Start looking at my rule suggestion, as this actually makes TS4 play like a tennis game, instead of this ping pong franchise on tennis courts it has become.

[ILuvBillVal]

ALL WORK AND NO PLAY MAKES JACK A DULL BOY.

[djarvik]

This match just made me realize that this game don't have any future whatsoever with Flat control shots being allowed. Easy as that. Start looking at my rule suggestion, as this actually makes TS4 play like a tennis game, instead of this ping pong franchise on tennis courts it has become.

Sorry, but your rule suggestion this time is just as insane as before. It is basically a honor system rather then a rule suggestion. In competitive environment this will never work. Friendly matches are fine, but once there are points on the line - things change.

No control shots flat shots? ...what happens if I have no time to react and press on time and hit control - should I give the point back to you? What happens if I hit control down the middle of the court - should I give you back the point? What if I hit a normal shot by pressing and releasing fast and it's not registered as a control shot? I am not even talking about the fact that you cannot see and know IF I hit control at all! ...or just a half or one third power shot. And so on.

There are so many holes in this endeavor of yours that I didn't even bother giving you feedback till now. You basically orchestrating hoe everyone should play and which shots to hit.

I say enjoy this as a way to play friendlies. I suggest to not even attempt to "agree" with someone to play such way on the tour, because if you do - you will quickly lose your virtual buddies, after you start accusing them of not giving you a point back for a control shot. ...or them accusing you.

Like I said, this is a honor system, not rules. Great for hitting sessions. Like in real tennis: "hey, lets try to hit only this way!". "Sure".

[ILuvBillVal]

It would be wayyyy to hard to enforce.

[Ary1g]

This match just made me realize that this game don't have any future whatsoever with Flat control shots being allowed. Easy as that. Start looking at my rule suggestion, as this actually makes TS4 play like a tennis game, instead of this ping pong franchise on tennis courts it has become.

Sorry, but your rule suggestion this time is just as insane as before. It is basically a honor system rather then a rule suggestion. In competitive environment this will never work. Friendly matches are fine, but once there are points on the line - things change.

No control shots flat shots? ...what happens if I have no time to react and press on time and hit control - should I give the point back to you? What happens if I hit control down the middle of the court - should I give you back the point? What if I hit a normal shot by pressing and releasing fast and it's not registered as a control shot? I am not even talking about the fact that you cannot see and know IF I hit control at all! ...or just a half or one third power shot. And so on.

There are so many holes in this endeavor of yours that I didn't even bother giving you feedback till now. You basically orchestrating hoe everyone should play and which shots to hit.

I say enjoy this as a way to play friendlies. I suggest to not even attempt to "agree" with someone to play such way on the tour, because if you do - you will quickly lose your virtual buddies, after you start accusing them of not giving you a point back for a control shot. ...or them accusing you.

Like I said, this is a honor system, not rules. Great for hitting sessions. Like in real tennis: "hey, lets try to hit only this way!". "Sure".

Okay, so we simplify it even more then.

No flat control short crosses.

That's pretty much the shot that takes all the fun out of the game today. It was those shots that got Welsh banned. Now, people use Agassi or whatever DFB on pro tour and spam those short angles like mad men.

In regular tour this shot should also be banned, just because the simple fact of it being such an immensely unrealistic shot..

It's absolutely no fun at all playing flat control short cross battles.

[djarvik]

While I totally agree with you about this shot...

...how do you plan to prove (cause you gonna need prove, trust me) that your opponent even hit this shot? Maybe he charged 1/10 of a meter and it was not a control? ...or better yet, he will simply say - No I didn't. What then?

[Ary1g]

Recording the match in worst case scenarios. You can't hit those angles unless you've had somewhat near max prep-time before the shot and also hits perfect.

In those situation though, the ball your opponent delivers pretty much is a winner anyhow he/she decides to execute it.

With normal/power shots, you almost don't have a chance of even hitting inside the service box without very good prep-time. Not once during my 7 realistic friendly matches now, have I seen anything at all near a flat shot that looks just like a flat control short cross. Not once.
With a little more testing, this rule should be added to the Official ones asap.

[djarvik]

But you haven't addressed my questions

People don't record their matches. 99.9 percent of them. This will turn fast into an endless accusation circle.

Assuming there is NO RECORDING. How do you deal with say, you claiming he did hit Control and your Opponent claiming he didn't?

And again, is it all flat controls? ...even the ones where you have little to no choice as you simply have no time?

What about mid court controls?

Pre-pressing makes your players slower, so on defense, I HAVE to hit a top spin or slice - no flats?

[ILuvBillVal]

I think it can definitely be redundant and often times even boring to constantly engage one another in cross court short rallies. However the problem lies within the game and not so much the tact. The players move far too fast and there are far too errors which leads to the problem of practically NEEDING to use depth changing shots to hit winners, particularly in matches against high level opponents.

If I'm playing another guy who can move and anticipate like me we would probably literally be there for days trying to best each other if we just hit side to side deep baseline shots. The only other option is to try and wrong foot your opponent but some guys are so good that rarely even works.

EDIT: Too FEW errors. Sorry fellas.

[djarvik]

I think it can definitely be redundant and often times even boring to constantly engage one another in cross court short rallies. However the problem lies within the game and not so much the tact. The players move far too fast and there are far too errors which leads to the problem of practically NEEDING to use depth changing shots to hit winners, particularly in matches against high level opponents.

If I'm playing another guy who can move and anticipate like me we would probably literally be there for days trying to best each other if we just hit side to side deep baseline shots. The only other option is to try and wrong foot your opponent but some guys are so good that rarely even works.

EDIT: Too FEW errors. Sorry fellas.

Spot on. Opening up a court even against a decent player who can anticipate well will be near impossible. Can you say 120 shot rallies?

...or are you saying Ary that every point MUST end with a net approach? ..or a passing shot?


...and that is somehow more realistic that short shots?