Ary for President!! =o)

[Tamthewasp]

My point was with R1 serve ONLY. I've played you countless times has 2 be more than 50 times and close 2 100.
I even mentioned the rule about SnV with low volley stats that you adapted it and made it 2 a less than 50 volley rule.

So again I say I say is using R1 SERVE REALISTIC?
Tell me pro players that use their SnV serve that stay at the baseline. This is not a personal attack, If it was I wouldn't have played you so many times. You are advocating Realism yet you defend an unreal tactic because you use it. This is what I find so hard 2 believe? Why advocate realism then defend an unreal part of the game?

[Ary1g]

Yes and No. I agree and disagree with your opinion. I guess that if you in real life want to go for a S&V, you can't change your mind halfway through it. However, if I want to go for a S&V irl, I wouldn't alter my service movement to something completely different. In example, you don't see Djokovic changing his service motion to Federers service motion if he tries to S&V.

Also, I like to think of it in the way Federer disguises his throw. It's hard to read what he's going to do based on this throw, so you'll never be sure what comes next. This is a very exciting mind-game imo.

In TS4 it's like my example with Djoker. It's like using two different service motions when going for S&V or regular. If the difference was smaller, like in Roddicks TS4 service movement, I would agree that there is no reason for R1-serving the whole time. However, that's not the case in TS4.

Therefore, I strongly disagree with you when saying it is unrealistic to use when the difference of serve motion is that great. It just becomes way to easy to see that your opponent is going for the net without doing it.

Also, I don't understand why you at all care to cry about it. Try using it, and I assure you that you won't see any difference in your match results or amount of aces. It doesn't make any other difference than look a little faster.

[Tamthewasp]

You are using the greatest tennis player of all time and the current no.1 as examples if you were the ts4 no.1 I would understand. I have used r1 2 serve and it clearly makes it harder 2 return. The game I used Murray and you said I returned the best in an online game. Pro/reg I'm not sure trust me when I say I returned average in that game

[djarvik]

Yes and No. I agree and disagree with your opinion. I guess that if you in real life want to go for a S&V, you can't change your mind halfway through

That's it.

I totally agree with Tam.

Ary, do you play real tennis on a competitive level? Ever did?

If no, than how do you know what is realistic and what is not?

Please don't say TV....

[Ary1g]

Yes and No. I agree and disagree with your opinion. I guess that if you in real life want to go for a S&V, you can't change your mind halfway through

That's it.

I totally agree with Tam.

Ary, do you play real tennis on a competitive level? Ever did?

If no, than how do you know what is realistic and what is not?

Please don't say TV....

My level in real tennis is not at all relevant in this discussion. You have already talked about the small tell-signs irl here and how easily you know when your opponent goes for S&V etc etc, however in TS4 these tell-signs are not small differences. They are MASSIVE. The whole body movement changes. Everything. It's two completely different serve motions. I also know you believe that if the serve is good enough you win the point anyway, however, this just proves how little time you spend playing this game competitively.

Let's play ONE match of ONE(or five if you like) set. Choose an All-round player, then I'll show you how EASY it is to just do short topspins against all those S&V attempts. If you win, I'll be forever silent about this and stop doing it immediately.

[djarvik]

So you having little to no expirince in real tennis is not relevant to a discuaaion in which you attempt to make a game more realistic?


Wow. Q? Is that you?


I have no desire to play at all. Sorry.


Wait a few weeks, there is more cheesy stuff to discover, trust me. Just like you missed the "problem" shot in your other 8 rule suggestions, you missed a few more, it just takes you time to discover something I knew from day one. You not giving me enough credit.

[Ary1g]

Okay, you got me, I have never touched a tennis ball all my life. I just saw my first real match on TV and it doesn't look like TS4. Hence my newest suggestion. I thought TS4 was how it looked, however, now I don't know. Nobody can even do a flat control short cross in real tennis... its so easy in TS4.. doesn't make sense....

Do you actually believe that I have no experience whatsoever with tennis IRL and for some weird reason spends so insanely much time on this forum trying to get people to play this game more realistically?

Is everything I say, nonsense compared to real life tennis? If so, I'm very surprised by the time you have spent discussing with me in the past. Glad to see that you're following and reading my posts though

Who knows? Maybe I am Q? And I've been around all this time without you knowing it. Nobody would ever think of Q as a northern norwegian dude with rule changing hysteria

[Tamthewasp]

But you still REFUSE 2 say R1 SERVE is unfair.,WHY? Because YOU USE IT. It really is that simple

[Ary1g]

It's not that simple.
http://www.intertopspintour.net/forum/v ... hp?t=16597

[Rob ITST]

But you still REFUSE 2 say R1 SERVE is unfair.,WHY? Because YOU USE IT. It really is that simple

Agreed.

Everyone does it to some degree, but Ary, you are one of the worst ever about this... if you don't like something, you call it unrealistic and unfair.

This game is so far from being realistic, that it's probably best if there are ZERO rules.

Wait a few weeks, there is more cheesy stuff to discover, trust me. Just like you missed the "problem" shot in your other 8 rule suggestions, you missed a few more, it just takes you time to discover something I knew from day one. You not giving me enough credit.

Yep. Every time you take a shot/skill/attribute away, you just uncover something else.

[Marco_Theo_81]

Wow I just read the tile of the thread before I clicked on it and I got a real surprise After reading the title alone, I really though that it was some sort of joke and expected a whole lot of bad words about me. However, this thread made my "forum-day"!

Thank you for your very kind words about me and my suggestion, Marco! It's nothing that feels better than people appreciating what I do here

You say it the best in this thread. I do these things to get closer to reality. I will always look for ways to improve realism in sports games and especially this tennis game, since this great community exists. I think we got a major improvement with the -42 rule, MD and SoB banned. However, after trying my newest rules, I just realized it's the flat control shots altogether I've always hated(realistically speaking).

Many people here say that it will be impossible to defend, no it won't. You can still use control topspins in whatever way you like, and same goes for slices.

Hei Ary

My intention was to wrote about your ideas in a funny way. I really like it.
And again, it's an individual feeling. Of course just to adapt in friendlys. ITST has its rules and they are official.

But for everyone again:

Short control cross hits are ok, if not abused and hited every time. Please don't think I am radical. I also use them, but in a choiced way.
The only problem I had, was to witness a match consisting almost just in those hits.

[Rob ITST]

Anything is boring when someone plays only one way: constant chip-n-charge, constant power shots, wide serving, slices.....

[Marco_Theo_81]

Hmm, I think you can apply a diversitiy consisting in control slices, power shots in every direction, diversitiy in the first serve. A prudence second serve with top spin.

Against Ary in our friendly match, with his suggestions, I felt not boring at all. I felt much pleausre. But this was my individual feeling I repeat.

But Rob, again, ITST rules are to follow. For sure.

And I would take this opportunity to say, how a great work you and the other responsibles do for this community.

[Ary1g]

I know Marco that you didn't mean all this, but I thought it was a funny post and thread, which I decided to exaggerate I fully agree with you saying that the game doesn't lose diversity with my rules. You still have the same diversity, however you can't win a point out of nowhere. We must play a realistic match very soon!

Rob, I have tried not doing fake R1-serves and the results where no S&V points going in my favor. My opponents changed depth of his return right away, so I rarely won points with S&V with 50-60 volley attribute. You simply don't have the volley skill to dig balls up from foot-height and place it well enough to stand a chance before your opponents next pass attempt. You are forced to only do drop volleys in those situation and judging by my experience with trying not fake R1-serve, there will be a cheesy number of drop volleys needed to do in order to win those points. My opponents too easily adjusted his return depth accordingly to me using R1 or regular serve.

[djarvik]

Okay, you got me, I have never touched a tennis ball all my life. I just saw my first real match on TV and it doesn't look like TS4. Hence my newest suggestion. I thought TS4 was how it looked, however, now I don't know. Nobody can even do a flat control short cross in real tennis... its so easy in TS4.. doesn't make sense....

Without getting into much detail, playing and watch tennis is as different as night and day. It may look simple enough to decipher, but trust me, this is one of the deepest sports out there. You are not even swimming in shallow waters, you simply stepped into a tiny puddle of water when it comes to your knowledge. I have been playing and coaching foreclose to 20 years now and I learn something new every day. My intent WAS to get you (as you put), because when talk realistic, and explain your reasons why - you are so off base that one can think you are playing some other game, not tennis. So if I were you , I would stick to the game, cheese, etc... and avoid real life compassing, as you are simply don't know what "real life is".

Do you actually believe that I have no experience whatsoever with tennis IRL and for some weird reason spends so insanely much time on this forum trying to get people to play this game more realistically?

Yes.

Is everything I say, nonsense compared to real life tennis? If so, I'm very surprised by the time you have spent discussing with me in the past. Glad to see that you're following and reading my posts though

I follow all posts, I like the reading and the interaction. I like arguing too. What I don't like is when people "deflect" when confronted with facts and when their "facts" are shown to be just "personal agendas". I admire your "never give up" spirit and this constant flow of positive energy, but I don't like the fact that when you are put in the corner, you don't acknowledged that and instead, find something else and completely forget that just a few days ago you were "way off base" of a similar subject, proclaiming that "this time" - THIS IS IT.

It reminds me of a McDonald's commercial, where they say: "...now with REAL meat!" - so WTF where you selling before that?!

Who knows? Maybe I am Q? And I've been around all this time without you knowing it. Nobody would ever think of Q as a northern norwegian dude with rule changing hysteria

No joke. The way you interact is almost identical. Granted, you more "there" then he was, but the resemblance is there.